76 Comments
User's avatar
NewYorker's avatar

How many movies have Hollywood made with tons of lies about other countries in Asia, Middle East, South America, andAfrica

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

Hollywood is private citizens. This is financed by the Chinese government. Big difference NY.

ChristineH's avatar

The reality is that people are still being bullied and harassed by Americans on the streets in modern days. You can’t grasp the real life cases but are only capable of finding some movie to create a wrong impression.

walt's avatar

I see, so if the US government had financed similar US movies then it would suddenly not be ok? Just FYI the US government did infact fund propaganda movies just like this one. Just thought you should be aware of that.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

So your claim is that the US government financed the most expensive professional feature-length films of their era, for distribution in theaters, and those films maliciously slandered our largest trading partners as warmongers?

Please, sir, do prove your point with facts and figures. The Ambition comments section awaits…

walt's avatar

So your main issue is that it was government funded? Would it have been ok if it had been privately funded? If the US governtment had funded Saving Private Ryan would you then say we were slandering Germany? Seems like your splitting fine hairs to make your arguement work. From what i could tell this film follows the exact same plot line as most american war films. While I am personally conflicted with the deaths of american soldiers, from an independant view point the film was pretty good. The explosions were way overdone though. Is your issue that they are trying to take some pride in a major victory? Or are you saying that anyone who makes a movie showing the US military failing miserably should be condemed.

Now if they had shown US soldiers going around executing civilians and dancing over their corpses then yea that would be problem.

Please tell me what exactly it is about this film that maliciously slandered the US?

You said they lied about the cause, purpose and responsibility? In what way?

“The Battle of the Lake Changjin set a perfect example for annihilating a US reinforced regiment… causing the greatest setback in the history of the Marine Corps.” And going further, “The battle completely tipped the scales of the Korean War and laid the foundation for the final victory of the War to Resist US Aggression and Aid Korea.”

The above statement is absolutly true, a little embellished perhaps but true.

Most of what you wrote describes american movies down to the last detail.

Yes the US government funded propaganda films and even to this day has control over any movie that uses government resources. Movies have been canceled or changed because the Governent didn't like a scene and such.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

How, exactly, could we lie about the German’s initiation of World War 2 that would slander them? Or that would be worse than the truth?

The Chinese and Soviets supported the brutal, immoral, murder of hundreds of thousands of people on the Korean peninsula, and this movie lies, seeks to gaslight the blame, and celebrated a macabre victory dance on American dead.

I take exception to it very much, as should you, every American, and every civilized human on the planet.

walt's avatar

Wow, talk about a fanatical response.

We lie all the time about our role in WW2 and our actions. We also depict all Germans as Nazi's when most were not.

Again how does it specifically lie? (exageration doesn't count)

Gaslight blame?

"celebrated a macabre victory dance on American dead" You can say this about most US war movies.

They won a tremendous Victory against a far superior force. Why wouldn't they celebrate it?Their strategy and tactics worked, caught US troops off guard. Otherwise you would have to call every attack the US ever won a massacre.

But you've taken this off topic. This issue was if this film was anti-american propaganda or "killing americans for entertainment" and such.

The facts are these. This movie follows the same general standard as US movies always have in these war stories. The movie is more about the bond of family and comrades than about bashing the US. Infact, aside from saying the US is a far superior force in number and technology (which was true) there really wasn't much of a discussion about the US. You seem to be using the beginning and end captions to justify everything. Also, the fact that it is american troops being killed.

If a US film company made the same movie, it would have likely been similar.

These are the only questions that really matter.

Is the overall story true? Yes

Is this movie any different from US war movies? No

Does it matter who financed it? No

Is it anti-american propaganda? After watching the whole movie-Not really

You may take exception to it, but reality doesn't change by denying it.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

"After the first-person-shooter hit Doom came out in 1993, the Marine Corps Modeling and Simulation Office (MCMSO) released the online Personal Computer Based Wargames Catalog where Army personnel published detailed reviews of the video games they investigated. Doom became the MCMSO's absolute preference, and in 1995, the game Marine Doom was released, and the alien-themed graphics of the game's first version was replaced by military-themed graphics.[17]"

There's quite a big difference between reviewing a video game and killing tens of millions of your own citizens.

Jesse Dustin's avatar

The idea that the American Military does not also fund propaganda aimed at influencing opinion seems questionable. I think the reason so many people bring this up in response to your article is that the American Government itself is viewed as a threat to the very freedoms it feigns to protect.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

Your claim is that the US Military finances the most expensive professional feature-length films of their era, for distribution in theaters, and those films maliciously slandered our largest trading partners as warmongers?

Jesse Dustin's avatar

Yes. https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/how-hollywood-became-the-unofficial-propaganda-arm-of-the-u-s-military-1.5560575

Any claim to the contrary is ignoring the facts.

In fact, it is even worse than that. The rise of the Internet and associated Technologies that we are using today (much to humanities detriment I would add) is the direct result of the build up of said Military Industrial Technology during and Post-WW2. In fact, most of the Technical thinking which plagues humanity today and alienates/de-humanizes man, to benefit the machine which the Military Industrial Complex spawned, is the direct result of decades of military funding. We no longer live in an age of violent War, we live in an age of War against man via "soft-power" like entertainment and technology. Our old hatred of Russia & the Cold-war was the impetus for all of this.

Ignoring how America has very much pushed this to the forefront is evading the truth.

Edmund Burke's avatar

wikipedia: dafe space for libs for marxism!

Les's avatar

The Pentagon has their Hollywood Office.

Unlikely that you do not know this.

_____

More to the point, US Armies have invaded numerous countries under the banner of Democratism, left those countries destroyed and in disarray, declared victory to the domestic American populations and went somewhere else.

For the readership here and not for yourself, modern day Hollywood is the perfect exemplar of the Nazi Era film director Leni Riefenstahl.

Mentioned here . . . https://les7eb.substack.com

Anne's avatar

America didn’t used to arrest it’s own citizens for challenging the propaganda (until the Obama/Clinton/Biden cabal got so cozy with the CCP).

Be careful which liars you choose to defend.

Scott S's avatar

Let those countries defend themselves. Question is why are you not defending yours? I bet you’re partaking in its benefits.

Hugh Brennan's avatar

Read "The Forgotten War." "The Last Stand of Fox Company." For a novel, "The Marines of Autumn." My F in L was at Pusan, Inchon, Chosin. A young Marine. If Truman hadn't stopped our forces from severing the Chinese supply lines at the Yalu, the North Koreans would be as productive , prosperous, and free as the South Koreans. It's an epic tragedy that we didn't use our power to free that country entirely. China's conscript peasants were slaughtered by the tens of thousands. Pork Chop Hill is probably the movie to see. I don't know why we allow ourselves to be humiliated like this.

ChristineH's avatar

Nonsense. Your reply is the exact reason you should be humiliated

MikeCasssh's avatar

Let’s not act like America doesn’t do the same thing guys

ChristineH's avatar

We don’t need to waste time here. They choose to filter out the reality which is why people don’t progress.

walt's avatar

So tell me how many US movies show the US troops raping and pillaging in Europe and Asia not to mention the multiple time that large non military and non strategic population centers were specifically targeted killing countless men, women and children. It may be propaganda but so are our movies as well. Now i love the US and the military but, we are far from being able to judge others.

Ted Faraone's avatar

Good post, Marc. I knew personally the American marine who led his men 50 miles to the safety of naval evacuation (John Chafee), and his No. 2 (James Brady), who would go on to be a prominent journalist. I am sure that you know that Chafee ended his career as a US Senator.

ChristineH's avatar

Obviously you are not sure who you are referring to

Ted Faraone's avatar

I mentioned only two people whom I know --or knew -- since they are now dead. Chafee was my uncle's protegé in politics. I knew Brady from his days at CBS and at the New York Post.

Purveyor of truthful things's avatar

Uhhh, have you ever watched "The Green Berets"??? It's literally the exact same thing as you're referring to with the Chinese movie, except it's Americans slaughtering Vietnamese by the car, truck, plane and tankload. How can you be so completely one-sided and biased?? It's ridiculous. Yes, the Chinese movie is a lot of propaganda. And the US has done the exact same thing, in hundreds and hundreds of movies. So our movie industry is private industry technically, who cares? We don't actually have a state run movie department, but that doesn't mean our propaganda movies don't serve the exact same purpose. Ugh, your article is infuriating. For a guy who writes such great inspirational articles about finding jobs, connecting, networking, etc, this article you wrote is extremely disappointing. Unsubscribring now from your newsletters now that I see your true colors...

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

Which movie was paid for by the propaganda arm of the State Department? Big difference between private citizens in Hollywood or Hangzhou making a movie and government sponsorship and direction.

colin's avatar

the military supports movies that depict it in a good light. take top gun, great movie, also propaganda

ChristineH's avatar

It’s really this type of article that makes me lose interest in this platform to read any other articles. What a pity.

Alex Lekas's avatar

This is a civilization that practices slavery, has no hesitation about cracking down on dissent or discriminating against non-majority populations, and regularly threatens Taiwan. I'm not sure why a film like this would be "beneath" what passes for Chinese dignity. More curious is the whataboutism here, with people ready to throw rocks at the place that does NOT demand that foreign films be censored and does NOT have its version of a Uyghur population and has NOT, thus far, rounded up people's pets for euthanizing. China doesn't have to worry about the US; we're doing a good job of tearing down the place from the inside.

ChristineH's avatar

Obviously you don’t have all the facts and stats and your life sucks so much which make you say so

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

Hey Youaregonnapay - I welcome contrary and dissenting voices here, but they need to be *productive*. Simply spamming every comment with a weak one-liner isn't going to work.

Can you try, please, to group your negative reactions into two or three longer, more substantive comments, please?

ChristineH's avatar
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Alex Lekas's avatar

What a convincing argument. This is bad trolling.

Jeannine Rutledge's avatar

I want to be clear; we want to put pressure on China for putting lies in a movie that we should be aware that is fake or not true but we are not doing anything about our own legislators passing bills to remove the history of racism, slavery and obscure how slavery black history is taught because it makes they like the way it makes America look today. Isn't that hiding the truth? We don't want to be lied on but America gets to lie and hide the truth as much as its wants. Got it!

Toby Bloom's avatar

It is sad that China has to be so tragically opposed to the US. They think they are pulling one over on us by being so absolutely hateful. The truth always comes out though. In the end they will pay be burning in hell for all their evil. We the proud and true Americans that we are will never take China,s spew. In the end China hurts China and their own history!

MikeCasssh's avatar

US does the same thing. they are all the same

Toby Bloom's avatar

if that is what you think then move to china! You education does not serve you well.

MikeCasssh's avatar

are you dumb? lol are you telling me American movies don’t make their enemies look like complete monsters?

Purveyor of truthful things's avatar

Such a typical response from a typical flag-waving "patriot". "You don't like it here, then leave!", instead of daring to have a critical eye towards our country and trying to identify when you're seeing propaganda from your own country or government!! How about YOU leave instead!! Open your eyes and have a critical viewpoint about something instead of telling someone to leave b/c they dare to think critically about some aspect of their own country!! Ask a black victim of the Tuskeegee experiments about how the US doesn't lie to its own people.

HT's avatar

You are not God, who are you to judge who’s evil and who’s good? All men are both good and evil at the same time; it’s not that america is the embodiment of pure good.

ChristineH's avatar

The truth always comes out to people who do not filter out the problems of their own country but analyze the factual accuracy of how media reflects the reality. You are never one of them.

Mike's avatar

You have little clue. I lived and worked in China. They have one goal ( everyone there) get by hook or crook all the world's knowledge and know how combined with all the world's resources to ( ultimately) take over the world! They are winning!

ChristineH's avatar

What do you think America is doing by absorbing all those international students from diff countries with “American dreams”?

Rachel's avatar

Right on the money, as always, Marc.

HT's avatar

While the CCP government is disgusting, the American government is not much better. Your yourself need to wake up from your propaganda-induced coma.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

The CCP is responsible for Tiananmen, Cultural Revolution, the famine during the Great Leap Forward, warmongering in the Spratlys as a means of conquest, HT. American government is much better.

HT's avatar

american government is responsible for the genocide of Amerindians, American-Spanish war, Haiti, Guatemala, Vietnam, Iraq, and much more. It might be 50% better but cannot be the embodiment of pure good.

Jeannine Rutledge's avatar

I really love how everyone hates to say and Slavery. America enslaved people. The American government enslaved people, starved them, hung them, burned them, treated them the same way Hitler did in concentration camps, yes right here in America right along with Indians, Mexicans, Cubans, Haitians, and other races. Just because we work with you today and walk the streets with you just like the Jewish people do today, does not mean it did not happen to us, Right here in America and America would like to forget it. It would like to erase that from history. Just like this Autor would like China to not print false information in movies. I don't want false information about America in movies either. I love my country. I am American always and forever. But its history and the truth should never be hidden by anyone. Not China, Russia or America.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

Thank you Jeannine. A full accounting of our history is valid and important for always improving how well we live up to our own principles. Thank you for raising these important but uncomfortable points.

Kenyatte Nelson's avatar

You write this article like you’ve never seen a Western with native Americans portrayed as savages. The white washing of world history and the perpetuation of non American/White stereotypes (ie Indian and Asian people as super smart but asexual, African and Native Americans as aggressive and ignorant, Europeans as either super villains or pompous aristocrats and Middle Eastern people as terrorists) has been going on for hundreds of years and continues aggressively today. The irony is that Americans massacred, rapped and pillaged the Native Americans, Americans enslaved people on US soil for hundreds of years, America has committed more terrorist acts and killed more innocents than any nation on the planet (we gun down more of our own citizens than the next hundred countries combined). The Chinese made a movie that made Americans look bad…that’s not a very difficult thing to do my friend.

Marc Cenedella, Author's avatar

These are foolish comments. Private citizens can make whatever movie they want - this is the case of the Chinese government ordering and paying for anti-US propaganda. They should be punished and shunned.

And your gun comments are typical liberal ignorance posing as arrogance. Facts matter, and the United States doesn't even have the highest number of gun deaths in the world, much more the next hundred countries combined: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country

Jeannine Rutledge's avatar

This is an argument for the sake of an argument. The truth is, anyone can make a movie about whatever they want. Today, no one is actually responsible for anything they do. We aren't accountable anymore. Gun makes, our government, food manufactures, no one, not even parents really. We are completely desensitized to violence, we lie in text books meant to teach the truth, our government leads us to believe we have power over our laws and we act as if we do things for the greater good when it is self preservation and self gratitude that feed us all. Let's not pretend that this argument is really about the truth in what America does or does not do. No one really knows the actually facts we were not there we know what was told to us and American lies on China all the time. Not that it's justifiable. We cannot control the masses so who cares to try. World powers do. Someone else said it already, the message is in the power of the narrative and the narrative is controlled by the media. If China would like to have their people believe America is terrible and bad they will have is so. When America wants to deliver a message, set a tone, deliver a lie, no one can stop them. Lie or not. Good luck changing the message China has decided to deliver to its people. I'm sure you get how that works as an author.

TQM's avatar

this movie is really good actually.

also doesn’t the military ensure their propaganda standard is met when “private citizens” Hollywood makes a military movie?

Kurt Eckert's avatar

Hey "New Yorker" - I'm a NYC resident and remember all too well when the NYT, New Yorker, and NY Review of Books ALL stood up for the "courageous 9/11 attackers" and apologized for the US role in various world affairs. How's that working for you now (re Ukraine, et al)? And I'm a progressive lib democrat veteran of decades of protest. We have enough blowhards to snuff out on the insurrectionist right without such intramural squabbles. Wake up, grow up. We live in an age of lies, and have presumable learned how to appropriately evaluate our entertainment & political industry.